Twelve twank reports in thirty minutes. It can only mean another round of PULL THAT FIC AND SELL IT!
ekimmuh, author of Finding Bella decided to pull it from FFn in light of the recent pulled/completed fic database (which didn’t even include her story).
From Finding Bella (the only chapter left up), her blog, and a Twilighted.net forum post:
It was brought to my attention tonight that some members of the fandom who are not happy about some of the fanfiction authors publishing their stories have taken it upon themselves to compile a list of fics and put them into a database for everyone to access who wants to. This makes publishing a story that one has written and posted on the fandom extremely difficult. It is sad that these individuals feel that they have the right from the author to take the story they’ve created to a larger readership, but that is exactly what is happening. We all share our writing on the fandom for free, but that does not mean that if we find our work to be ‘good enough’ we would not want to try and publish it and make money from it. We all put a lot of time and effort into these stories.
Our C&P links to all those websites confirming how ILLEGAL that is have begged us to give them a vacation, so we won’t bother.
So, it is with a sad heart that I have removed Finding Bella. Given that I have announced that I am publishing a novel (not Finding Bella), I feel that I, and my story will soon be targeted by this group. Believe me when I say that I do this with great sadness. I know that Finding Bella has a huge following in the fandom and that it will be missed.
That’s a lot of self-importance. Allow us to translate.
*WANK* *WANK* *WANK*
With that said, I want to assure you that you all will get your ended. Unfortunately, due to what is going on, you are now going to wait until the story is published. It will be a series of books instead of one and I am hoping to have the first one out, if all goes well, sometime next year.
At first, we thought this meant she was publishing Finding Bella, even though she just said the paragraph before that she wasn’t, but truthfully, her blog post was so poorly written that we’re not even sure what she means. Since she spends many words defending her copyrights, we’re going to tentatively assume she intends to publish her fanfickshun.
I will not be disappearing from the fandom, and I will probably still write here although I will most likely be sticking to cannon or AU stories from now on.
We’ll all just be jumping to read that, since you treated your HUGE FOLLOWING with such obvious respect with your last story.
I am asking that if you do have a copy of Finding Bella saved on your hard drive that you do not share it. Many of you will not be happy with my decision, but I do hope you understand. This is personal. Whether or not an author used the Twilight characters as a jumping board or not write their story, it is still their story and belongs to them. I ask my readers to please respect that and not help add to this.
In response to a reply on her blog post:
Charmie,
No. This is not selfless. I put a lot of time and energy into this story and if I would like to publish it one of these days then that is something I feel is perfectly within my rights to do as it has nothing to do with Twilight. Putting it on the blog or another site would not protect it from being stolen. The only option was to take it down, which is what I have done.
Insert the same 10 or 20 links to copyright law here.
Just no.
Her Twitter and blog suggest that she’s in support of TWCS, who we twanked last month for basically being thieves. They’re also the “publishing house” that’s about to market such treasures as Just Wait and The Perfect Wife, whose author is about to have some kind of big reveal in the next eight days, idk idk. It’s not a big leap to assume she plans to submit Finding Bella to them as well, if they haven’t already agreed to steal her HUGE FOLLOWING’s money publish it already.
That’s just speculation though. It’s possible she’s going to a real life publisher to query her fanfickshun, but since she recently made an entire blog post whining about Twilighted beta feedback, we don’t think she’s up for all that.
Twilighted is a privately owned site and the administrators have the right to run it as they see fit, however, as the author I have issues with being asked to change my story.
.
Twankhard 
Damn! I was just about to Twank this to you guys, but you beat me to it.
I think the author lucked out and found a scapegoat to redirect it ire of the fandom when she pulled the story. TUT TUT!
As for ‘The List’, it’s a free site where people can go to download pulled and popular complete or pulled/incomplete fics. The behind the scenes swapping has moved into the open.
Twankhard, you should be TWANKED for not having an ‘Edit’ button! :oP
I now have an errant ‘IT’, and a missing ‘THE’ :o(
Fuck! I was just about to send this one in. This lady is a piece of work. Has anyone read that thread on Twilighted? It’s popcorn worthy no doubt. She has NO idea what the hell she was doing writing that fic.
She dragged the whole thing along and turned into into a BDSM fic instead of showing Edward helping Bella heal which was what she said the story was about. There was NO progression in that fic whatsoever. It was like she was doing it for the reviews. WHERE did that story move? Someone tell me because I sure as fuck didn’t see it.
I find it funny that she’s blaming people passing fics around as her excuse. Ego much. You’re not that special.
I don’t give a shit who publishes. If you publish a book I WILL buy it as long as you’re not publishing a PULLED fan fic.
The link on Google docs isn’t STEALING fics so people need to get the fuck off that.
“A girl who is broken and a Dom who’s willing to do what he’d never thought he would in order to help her. There are some pretty dark themes in this especially at the begining.”
JFC. Yawn.
One word: cunt
i’m sure it will be a best seller…and this too is why I don’t start WIP’s anymore.
Um. Does anyone else think she’s just butthurt that her story wasn’t included?
I’m also confused as fuck by her explanation. She pulled it because she’s “publishing” something else, and
notbeing on that list could jeopardize that–never mind that she just made it a sure thing that FB will be included now–but at the same time, we’ll only get our “ended” when FB is “published?” As a series?Someone tried to synchronize her story with…herself…and failed.
I say this like I ever read the beginning, much less give a shit about the “ended.”
My thoughts exactly, deer! She just guaranteed that her fic that I never would’ve read for free (let alone paid for as an EXTENDED SERIES) will get on the pulled fic database, and that’s kind of a misnomer because all of the fics aren’t pulled and I’ve yet to hear certain fanfic writers comment on it. She’s doing a lot of double talk in that post, which tells me she’s a fucking lying liar who lies badly. I think Twankhard is correct that this girl will probably/has approached/has been approached by one the vanity presses within the Twilight fandom because complaining about editors and then saying you want to be a real published writer just proves that you don’t know what real writing is. I’d say that 75% of the work REAL writers, particularly first-time published, is in the editing. If someone’s expecting to publish and has a hard time being told by editors what changes need to be made for the improvement of the story, then they either want a bad publisher or they have an unrealistic dream.
Has anyone else read the ass-kissing and “shame on those evil, vile readers” comments in response to her A/N on FFn? I call bullshit on those posts from people awaiting the publication of FB, which will be Finding Shitty-Name-That-Is-Not-Bella.
It’s already on the pulled fic database – scroll down…
PS. It sucked anyway (yet I kept skimming; twank’s on me)
also on her Twitter: “I have to do what’s best for me and my family”. WTF does that even mean? I lol at that excuse. Insert Hoarders reference here.
I have to do what’s best for me and my family.
Yeah. We’ve heard that before. After The Office got pulled. Translation: “I’m going to be richer than Stephenie Meyer.”
Who here has read the office? I’d heard everybody was obsessed with it and couldn’t wait to read it but then when I did it was just 70% sex, 20% melodrama like she was the first secretary banging her boss and 10% plot, as in I’m-so-scared-of-my-feelings-hey-let’s-mention-yet-again-that-you’re-so-beautiful.
How is writing something like that help her *family* in any way? Jeez. XD
Man, I was so disappointed in the diabetic-coma-inducing ending of that fic. I read it as a WIP, I posted on the thread, I encouraged the writing, I really liked it as a solid smutfic… and then they went to Seattle. And it all went downhill. Actually, it really went south for me once they got back from Seattle.
Way too sappy for my tastes. Everything was just too perfect. I could only hope that that Bella would have trouble getting pregnant or something so it would at least slightly resemble a real life with actual problems and disappointments.
But you are absolutely right – it was a total smut-for-smut’s-sake-fic – and I think it did that very well at the beginning (I’m looking at you, La Perla dressing room). But it certainly wasn’t some ground-breaking new concept in romance or illicit relationships or office politics, etc.
Word! I was so waiting for her to get pregnant in that fic from all that sex. It wasn’t great writing but it was the first fic that was smut for smut’s sake. It DID go downhill after Seattle and just all around boring. The ending sucked ass, lackluster doesn’t even begin.
At least the La Perla scene was hot.
No words…
OMG, not again… Man, one of this days S. Meyer’s gonna be even more rich than she already is with all the ‘incomes’ she could make from twilight-fanfiction-made-bad-novel. Mmmhh, probably not much, but maybe she’ll make more in court.
All I read during that Twank was ekimmuh bitching and moaning blah blah blah pulling fic yadda yadda yadda don’t share my fic yah yah yah I want to publish on the back of this fandom! That author has got no fucking idea how this fandom works. Pulling a fic – no matter the reason – is only going to piss your ‘fan’ base off and give the writer a bad name.
I think that ekimmuh needs to realise that she has fucked herself big time. I wonder if she will be screaming Morgan as she orgasms?
“I think that ekimmuh needs to realise that she has fucked herself big time. I wonder if she will be screaming Morgan as she orgasms?”
I think i love u.
We really need a gif maker on board.
Word.
I suppose RA is out of the question…
You’re kind of beautiful….
She won’t leave us hanging, we can find out the ending just by buying her book series.
Seriously?
Buh-bye.
Please gods of fic, somebody must have it somewhere. We need it distributed stat.
It’ll be up by the weeknd.
finding bella…although not sure why you’d want it…
https://docs.google.com/leaf?id=0B5CA1kHTPgarY2ZkOTNiNzAtYzcyOC00MmMwLThkNDEtY2MyNjE4ODFhYjAw&sort=name&layout=list&num=50
I don’t know why these people get their knickers in a twist. If someone saved my fic then put it up with my penname, I think I’d be flattered.
Thank God she pulled it. It was a crappy story anyway. I could never work out the motivation behind her Edward’s actions. Her writing was pretty ordinary too, you only have to look at her blog posts to see that. No great loss as far as I’m concerned.
ITA.
There were so many things wrong with this fic, I don’t even know where to begin. She actually did the fandom a huge favor by pulling this crap fest.
Ego adveho pro talentum
Latin for: Big ego=little talent?
I never read FB, nor did I want to, but someone please distribute that shit for my sideline amusement. It just has to be done when there are self-important comments like these.
Exactly! As an author/reader, I have to say I just want it passed around to piss her and her self-importance off. This just needs to stop.
It was a very crappy story but just for my lulz amusement I can’t wait for it to be up by the weekend.
It’s already been put up on the gdocs. She’s very speedy.
Of course, this just means that it will get WAY more attention now because it has the patina of a great fic that was pulled due to controversy. She’ll actually probably end up with an even larger fanbase now that she made that list.
*sigh*
Help I can’t access the gdoc!
https://docs.google.com/leaf?id=0B5CA1kHTPgarMDM5ZGI5N2ItNGI0NC00N2NlLWE2M2EtYTllN2IyMTEwYzUz&hl=en
*claps* This. I don’t want it either, but for the same reason I’d also like to see it on the list.
*Yeah* Happy to see FB on the list. Shit, I have a story on the list-don;t ask me why. I don’t pull my fics, have never threatened to, don’t have any plans to because IT’S FANFIC.
Me and another author saw our fics on that list, and we were like ‘hell, there’s some good fics on that list, I’m flattered to be included.” BUt then hey, we’re not BNAs, trying to push people around.
Authors come to ffnet because they have a chance at an immediate audience, which is a great thing. Clue in on the fact that the moment you publish on ffnet, you have lost control. You want to keep control of your fanfic? Keep it locked up on your own computer.
I emailed her and asked why some completed but not yet pulled stories were included, and she said that she didn’t do it with malintent. She said if she had a cleaned, PDF copy of a completed story, she put it up there, pulled or not. She said she has TONS of stories that still need to be uploaded but since they’re not “cleaned” of HTML code, etc, she’s not posting them.
Just have to say, if there’s one thing that canon writers have in common– besides not pulling fics to publish– we know how to spell canon.
You probably know how to spell “caning,” too. (Hint: It’s not “canning”).
Oh shit – I got confused with the label-less cans in Domward’s cupboard. I thought he was into canning.
*shrugs*
Yeah. Caning makes much more sense. My bad.
Oh FFS….waaahhh twanky wah…
What a load of sank and shit. I’m so sick of authors pulling to publish….go do what other fandom writers have successfully done and write an ORIGINAL NON-TWILIGHT related story and put your heart and soul into being rejected by real publishing houses until you finally find someone who has faith in your ORIGINAL writing and plot…
Only after that…do you have the right to bitch and moan….no ones taking advantage of you by sharing your story…you’re just whiney because you have no way of knowing how many “hits” the story has, or people aren’t “reviewing” so you’re not getting your ego inflated….
Anyone have a copy?! I never did read it.
Went to look at the story which I’ve never read. So sad that the “fuller summery” mentioned in the summary is no longer inside. It’s getting cold here and I could use some summery.
LMAO
She can’t spell for shit. Just her author’s note has enough mistakes to addle my brain. I “shutter” to think what the story was like when it was up.
BWAHAHAHAHA! She really said “you will get your ended”
I took that “you will get your ended” as a threat and loaded the shotgun.
BAW!
squalls = ekimmuh
QED worldwide bitches!
I scanned the story for a bit out of curiosity and found Edward “mauling over” something. Not even close, dude. Even in a bdsm fic I doubt there is mauling involved.
LOLOLOLOLOL
I’ve never even heard of this story, have no intentions of ever reading it, but I want it to add to my mediafire in case someone else would like it. I can’t believe these people are daft enough to try to control the sharing of FREE derivative fiction that they’re being given full credit for. If you want to be a real published author with a real copyright and all of the cool, legit cease and desist powers that come with it, don’t write your original idea around someone else’s characters and put it on a fanfiction site. It’s as simple as that.
I agree Anonnnie. Fanfiction should be a place where we can have fun with characters and try different writing styles. If you are lucky you might get some good feedback to help you improve (great chapter, update soon does not constitute good feedback) and perhaps learn from other authors in fanfiction.
The world of fanfiction is not like real world publishing. You have borrowed characters, plots, places and lets not forget you have borrowed the ending (HEA is what your readers expect). You have also borrowed fans of Twilight. This is the reason why you don’t own copyright, whether you post on your blog, fanfiction or elsewhere.
I really do hope that some of the authors I have enjoyed reading will go out and write their own stories and get published. Starting with a blank page and an idea is the only way you’ll know that you truly own the copyright. No publisher is going to take you on if the work isn’t original (and they have ways of checking this). When you sign with a real life publisher most contracts have clauses noting that this is a work of original fiction. If the publisher is sued it is then the responsibility of the author to pay costs such as permissions or court costs if it gets that far. So for fanfic authors looking to get published with works of derivative nature (ie. fanfiction) be warned the onus of originality is with you in the eyes of copyright law.
Yep…. real life publishers have learned their lesson after the debacle of publishing Cassie’s nightmare of cliches and plagiarized… oh, I mean embedded “pop culture homages” of better, original works.
I know there are original fic places similar to FFn, but even in those cases, if I were looking to publish legitimately, I wouldn’t post my WIP anywhere online. But that’s just my paranoid ass.
Who’s Cassie?
Cassie Clare = Mortal Instruments.
Wrote some fanfic, people say her HP Draco Trilogy is the Mortal Instruments but others say it’s different. In her other fanfic they say she lifted lines and passages straight from other books and said it was her own.
Don’t canon authors lift lines from Twilight to use in their fics? Who’s used “you’ll be the death of me” in their fic?
It wasn’t just the original HP series that she lifted material from, she also took from other writers and well-known stories. Doing that in fanfic is boring enough, but doing that and submitting your fanfic masquerading as original fiction to big publishers… deserves a smack in the face. That’s all old fandom drama though. I was just mentioning it because she’s the last/only fanfic writer that I know of to get picked up by a decent publisher, and since then there seems to be more wariness about signing on fandom authors based on the idea that their readers would follow them, imo. And we all know that the theory of carrying over fans is a crock. When writers pull fanfic for publication, I just say “buhbye, bitch” and read another free fic. It’s no sweat off my back, and most importantly, it’s no money from my bank account.
Dear god. Psymom loves Cassandra Clare. Where is that brilliant *cough* interview the two of them did? If I remember correctly, CC pretended that she never had anything to do with fanfiction, while Psymom completely toadied to her.
It was like reading one of those self serving “interviews” on Southern Fan Fiction Review. BFFs4EVAH!
Ok I really don’t understand this whole turn a fic into a published novel biz. Do I want to get published someday? Sure that’d be awesome and the process is brutal for sure. But would I take my fic and do that? That’d be a resounding hell no. I mean seriously. IT’S FANFICTION.
No matter how original these so-called BNA’s think they are they’re using characters that are NOT original. They’re owned by SM, Little Brown and now Summit. Change the names? Sure that changes evvvvvveeerrrything. The only plausible way to transform a fic is to completely redo it. From character descriptions and development to general plot, location, timeline, and all. So why not just be original if you want to get published?
Sure getting ff published is easy thanks to TWCS and Omnific but hey stealing shit from a grocery store is easy too. Does being easy make it right? No. It’s still taking something that wasn’t yours to begin with either way you slice it. Another seriously twankworthy thing. Twilighted.net on their home page ASKS for donations to keep the site running. Hmm asking for money to host twilight fanfic with a name of the site that is just two letters off of being “twilight”. Yeah that’s a lawsuit waiting to happen. It happens all the time in fandoms and maybe a grey area but it’s ridiculous.
It’s ridiculous that these people think they’re so smart that their fans will buy it just to have a copy of their beloved fic. Dude, it’s called the internet. Torrents of books, movies, cd’s go up and get downloaded a million times a day what makes you think that they won’t just be part of the system everyone else in any kind of media are subjected to?
Big fat fail on all these fic authors, trying to swindle their “fans” out of money with the same ole stuff we already read.
I just came. Thank you.
Oh, I think I might love you.
“Sure getting ff published is easy thanks to TWCS and Omnific but hey stealing shit from a grocery store is easy too. Does being easy make it right? No.”
I wholeheartedly agree. Anyone, and I honestly mean anyone, can publish their fan fiction as an original novel. Whether they use TWCS, Omnific, or some other online e-book publishing source, anyone can do it. However, people who choose that are overlooking this huge point–it is unethical. (And possibly illegal–but hey, I’m not a lawyer. I can’t sit here and argue copyright law with anyone.)
I honestly believe that it is only a matter of time until S. Meyer’s legal camp gets wind of those operations and shuts it down. I know that when Omnific first made waves back in February? March? there was conversation on ADF about this potentially being the end of Twilight Fan Fiction, because the best way to shut down operations like Omnific would be for SM to say “ah, nope, not going to allow it to happen anymore.” A. Rice did it a few years back, 2008 I believe, with her novels. It hasn’t happened yet, but I wonder how far-fetched an idea that actually is.
On a kind of side note–does anyone know the specifics of deals that Omnific makes? Like, how much $$ are those authors really making? How many books are really being sold? Someone in nonnie-land must have some inside scoop.
Anne Rice did it back in 1999, I think. I remember because I was in fanfiction back then.
SM’s too egotistical to let her lawyers shut Omnific and TWCS Publishing House down. She sees herself as a great literary influence and icon, comparing herself to the greats, while Shakespeare, Milton and Austen all spin in their graves.
How much money? Not much, according to Lisa Sanchez;
“I don’t make much for my books, people. In fact, my last check was enough to pay for one of my daughter’s cheer bows. One bow people. That tells you something.”
from http://www.calicheermom.com/2010/10/douchebag-award.html
*snickers* Yes, please! Someone has to have some numbers. How many copies are these people selling. It seems VERY VERY VERY vanity publishing, i.e. dish out more money than you rake in.
i am wondering if the entire world talented enough to get published? everybody & their aunts are getting published & ofcourse since all ff are long ass never ending dragged out stories of chapter upon chapter …it just has to be a ‘series’ of books. really?! however much i may like the ff if you pull it off before it’s got to the end just so you can push the readers to buy your ‘original’ story that is not in any way based on Twilight – guess what? it will just piss the readers off. no one is going to buy the bloody book. especially this FB thing. i have read & cringed at every single chapter. no one is going to allow publication of something that descriptive in the first place….in the guise of BDSM people write all kinds of shit & i mean that literally. good riddance in this case i say.
and for peeps wanting to read it…i say it’s best you haven’t wasted time on this stuff. it’s bella who was a sex slave saved by the knight in shining dom armor who purchased her only to make her his sub, have her kneel at the door step..yadayadayada…you know how it goes from there.
^^THIS^^
All these people pulling to publish make it seem SOOOOOOO easy.
Uh huh….
“…and for peeps wanting to read it…i say it’s best you haven’t wasted time on this stuff. it’s bella who was a sex slave saved by the knight in shining dom armor who purchased her only to make her his sub, have her kneel at the door step..yadayadayada…you know how it goes from there.”
This sounds like The Story of O for assmonkeys….
oooh.
WHEN will people learn that once you post something on the internet, it’s not going to be your private property anymore? It’s called the WORLD WIDE WEB for a reason. Anyone anywhere has access to it at anytime, and the only way you can keep them from, say, copying & pasting is to get a *real* copyright. Which, as stated time and time again, is not legal. Why do they think they’re told to pull their fics when they’re being “published?” (As always, I use that term loosely here…) It’s because they (“publishers”) don’t want any evidence of it having been anything but original. You don’t want people to access your shit? DON’T POST IT ON THE FUCKING INTERNET. /rant
Am giggling at the flutter this has started on Twitter!!
I can’t believe she pulled an incomplete…at least some of the last few that have been pulled have been finished!
It’s been added to the gdocs site. Love how she used it as a scapegoat for why she was really pulling her shit story.
It’s sad really. The story wasn’t even on our radar until it was brought to our attention that it was pulled.
Hey- can we get Breakfast at Tiffany’s” on the list…? Thankx
It’s been added and pears13 stuff will be added by this weekend.
What happened to all of pears13’s stuff? When did she pull?
She pulled all her stories off FF.net yesterday.
Dear God, the #ULAL writer pulled her stuff?
Breakfast at Tiffany’s is still under hmonster4’s profile you know.
and Profmom
I may have another story for you, but I can’t figure out how to contact you by looking at the googledocs.
Can some one please help me with getting the gdoc!
https://docs.google.com/leaf?id=0B5CA1kHTPgarMDM5ZGI5N2ItNGI0NC00N2NlLWE2M2EtYTllN2IyMTEwYzUz&hl=en
You can email the owner at TwilightFFnStories@gmail.com if you have something to add (I figured it would be ok to list her email since it’s on the gdoc site).
It is the “owner” of the gdoc, like if the name listed there is BarackO then you can email BarackO@gmail.com <– just an example
Apparently, people are still iffy on the legality of this whole thing. Regardless of the legality, it’s also unethical! No matter what type of story we have written, the basis of our characters in fan-fiction is without a doubt derived completely from SM’s characters. While SM’s Edward might not have been a complete bastard, we manipulate him for our own ends. His possessiveness and control-freakishness are amplified in one story, while his purity is downplayed, etc. Publishing something that is based off of another thing that is not yours is STEALING.
This seems very simple to me. I also didn’t take my meds today, so my logic might be off. *wink*
Thank you!
You are exactly right. Some people think the legality is on the side of the authors who are pulling their fan fiction stories and publishing them as “original” fiction. You know what? That could be. I’m not a lawyer. I don’t know.
What I do know is that it is HOLY unethical. I mean, protest all you want, but if you are writing Twilight fan fiction, some part of you is a fan of Twilight–the movies, the books, the characters, something. Therefore, if you turn your fan fiction into an “original” fiction and make money off of it, you are earning that money off of the work the original author–Stephenie Meyer–did. As a fellow author, why would you want to do that?
For me, it boils down to the fact that if I am going to put in all the hard work, time, and effort into writing a story to be published, why wouldn’t I want that work to be completely, 100% original and MINE? I would any success or regard about my story to be something that I can completely own, which wouldn’t be the case if said story was originally written as fan fiction.
And let’s be serious–if one of these fan fiction to “original” fiction authors does become moderately successful, say successful enough to be interviewed somewhere or published by a legit publishing house so their novel shows up in an actual bookstore, do you not think the fandom would be all over that in a second? I mean, if I were to go to my neighborhood bookstore and see one of those Omnific novels in print there–a novel that I originally read for free on FanFiction.net or Twilighted.net–I would sure as hell march right back here, or somewhere on the Internet, and make a fuss about it. I would do a lot of things, but the one thing I wouldn’t do? Buy it.
Hell no.
Apologies. This was long. I get all flustered when it comes to this topic, because it makes me quite angry to see fan fiction authors take advantage of their readers and the original inspiration like this.
While I don’t disagree with you, I have to ask if what Stephenie Meyer wrote wasn’t a form of fanfiction? Twilight revolved around classics like Pride and Predjudice and Wuthering Heights? Aren’t most stories that are written (and published) inspired by what the author was influenced by?
Just food for thought.
this is true, but do you realize that most romantic stories/books/movies/whatever are based off of pride & prejudice as well as several other classic novels? ex. for p&p: boy meets girl, they hate each other, common misunderstanding is cleared up, and OH! look at that, they’re suddenly in love.
I was aware of that. There is a thing called fair use within the law, along with the fact that you can’t copyright things like “boy meets girl, hates each other, misunderstanding cleared up, and falls in love”.
I’m just pointing out this posters ethical observation.
“What I do know is that it is HOLY unethical. I mean, protest all you want, but if you are writing Twilight fan fiction, some part of you is a fan of Twilight–the movies, the books, the characters, something. Therefore, if you turn your fan fiction into an “original” fiction and make money off of it, you are earning that money off of the work the original author–Stephenie Meyer–did.”
Where I can see both sides of the dilemma, I am playing devil’s advocate in this instance. The fact is that SM did use P&P as her diving board when she wrote Twilight. She also didn’t want to give the name of the book she fashioned BD after before it was released (can’t remember the name, there were two) because she thought it would give away too much of what would happen. I’m just asking what the difference is?
For the record: this is off topic and has nothing to do with “Finding Bella”. I don’t have issues with authors that pull completed fics, my gripe comes with ones that pull their WIP stories to rope their readers into buying a book to get the ending. THAT IS UNETHICAL.
oh, i wasn’t disagreeing or saying that any of this is ethical. just pointing out the interesting fact that so many romantic stories are fashioned after P&P. anyway, yes i *completely* agree that posting your story up til a pivotal point & then pulling to publish is completely ridiculous and could be seen as unethical. my hubby calls it a marketing ploy. i call it amateur writing with stardust in their eyes. they think their stupid little story is going to make them famous? think again. they haven’t had to do any form of characterization whatsoever (unless their story is WAY ooc, i guess). they’ve leaned on fanfic for those purposes throughout the entire writing process in this case.
If you’re going to go that far, then you might as well say that all forms of modern literature are fanfic of one thing or another. Hell, not just modern, pretty much any form of entertainment writing ever was inspired by other stories or legends or actual events.
Being inspired by a story is different than taking the characters of that story and placing them in your own while using their names, the places the story takes place in, defining characteristics, etc.
This is an interesting conversation. The story of Noah and the flood is, essentially, a fanfiction of the Epic of Gligamesh. Every story throughout history is always influenced by something or someone else, based in myth or reality, fiction and non-fiction. Everything.
It’s not that there is never original thought but that thought is always influenced by something, the application of the influence is what becomes unique. I’m not creative enough to write anything but I’m happy to see a few good examples of this in fanfiction recently. Angstgoddess was excellent at this in Wide Awake, her use of Unicorn is an example. I just read a great oneshot with the unique application of the concept of the myth of the Rivers Lethe and Mnemosyne to a relationship called Summer of Lethe’s Demise by gothictemptress. There is an excellent example in the Harry Potter fandom written by Anna called Roman Holiday where she bases her entire plot on Palestrina in a new way. Another example for Twilight is Belladonna’s The Cullen Campaign, where the court case of Lemon is applied in a new, more romantic way too. She creates a new double meaning using Lemon. Those are just some of the examples. Unicorns, Myths, Lemons, The music of Palestrina are all ideas of previous ideas of previous ideas of previous ideas.
It’s all still fun to read even if it’s been done before. Some fanfiction authors are just taking themselves way too seriously. Hola egos. What’s crazy is when authors pull their story for the reasons ekimmuh gave. It goes against reason. If she’s not lying and really is trying to publish an original story it’s more reasonable to leave her story up to maintain the interest of her fan-base by keeping them happy (even if they are incest loving creepers) and mentioning the progress of her original story in her updates. You keep interest by staying active in the fandom of your choice. Instead she’s using her ego and future books as leverage. It’s counterproductive to pull the story for her reasons and incredibly douchey.
Interesting point. Definitely.
The legalities of what exactly constitutes fan fiction, that can be someone else’s battle. I’m not going to get involved in that. However, I think that S. Meyer found inspirations in the themes that existed in “Pride and Prejudice” and “Wuthering Heights,” but those themes are found in nearly every romantically-based movie, novel, and television show in existence. Do those themes start with “Pride and Prejudice” or “Wuthering Heights?” Or, do they go back even further? I’m not sure.
I don’t, however, consider the interpretation of such themes to be taboo or immoral. In example, the idea of a forbidden love–in S. Meyer’s case between a vampire and a human–has been portrayed in thousands (or perhaps hundreds of thousands) of different ways.
What is taboo, in my humble opinion, is the copying or being inspired by characterizations–the way said characters act to different situations and to each other. I think that is what makes turning a fan fiction story into an “original” fiction story so…uncool. If I write my story as fan fiction, even if Edward is an alcoholic, biker who is extremely promiscuous, he’s still going to end up with Bella. He’s probably going to be possessive over her, and he’s going to feel this weird, unexplainable attraction to her. He’ll probably be very good looking, and she’ll be rather plain–but beautiful to him. I mean, even though his basic character is outwardly SO different than canon Edward, there is still SO much that is very, very similar. You can’t erase that by changing his name to “Bob” and moving the story from Seattle to South Beach.
But, very, very, very interesting point on what constitutes fan fiction. I can honestly say that I’ve never thought about it in that way before.
oh jeebes: While I would completely agree with your assessment that being inspired is different from using the characters of a published work, I wouldn’t go so far as to say that all modern literature is a form of fanfic. You cannot defend a copyright that is based on normal situations like boy meets girl. However, SM stated, and even used the books in her story, that they were inspired by the classics. NOT, boy meets girl, but specifically P&P and WH. I’m just curious why she can do it and FF authors cannot? Is it because they were previously posted with Twilight characters online? Because the names were used. the stories are now nul and void for publishing? SM’s book is more of a fanfic of the classics than some of the stories being pulled for publishing.
Jane Smith: My comments were only made to remind everyone that SM herself has been inspired by works of fiction (themes of P&P & WH). So with that being said, some fanfics have nothing to do with Twilight except for the characters (which they were inspired by). So therein lies the question…what is it exactly that you can be “inspired” by and what is unethical inspiration?
I’m just throwing out an apposing POV to get people to think about what they are saying instead of jumping on the “people who publish are pinheads” band wagon, though I’m clearly in the minority when it comes to looking at both sides of the coin.
I can understand the irritation when fanfic authors do nothing but change the names and locations of the characters, leaving all other characteristics (I feel the same way, its theft of a beloved character); however, should a person be penalized because they re-write a FF and there is nothing of Twilight value in it? Does it really matter that it was originally a FF?
Another argument could be that they are extorting the readers that they gained to make money off their TWILIGHT fanfic. So let me ask this question…if an author pulled a story, didn’t give an explanation, turned around and published with a REAL publisher but didn’t inform the FF community, would you be upset if you found out because they didn’t use their readership for monitary gains?
I’m sorry, I’ve gone off on another topic again and asked a question that you didn’t initiate, but I suppose we could pose that question to the group because I am interested in the answer. We hear a lot of people say its unethical to publish (some say it’s illegal, however that is debatable since litigation changes with every judgment), but then those that say it’s unethical use the excuse that it’s stealing SM’s story to make a profit. However, I’d love to see a deeper discussion/debate on what is actually unethical when the finished work (re-written FF) doesn’t resemble twilight in the least. What part of the “pulled FF for publishing” is so enraging?
We see clearly that the author we are discussing on this thread used their readers interest in an incomplete story to benefit finacially, which is a coupletely douche move to do. However, we suddenly lump all authors who pull fics in the same category as this woman, which I don’t necessarily believe is the case.
Again, I am playing devil’s advocate here. I appreciate the hearty debate and hope that we get more interesting responses besides angry comments with no substance behind them except righteous indignation.
You play the devil’s advocate well. 🙂 I thought of this after reading one of your comments:
FF author completes a piece of AH fan fiction that doesn’t have anything in common with Twilight apart from the names. She pulls it *after* completing it, changes names, locations and characterizations, tries to publish but *doesn’t* tell anyone from her fandom fans to follow her and buy her book if/when it gets published. Since she doesn’t tell anyone from the fandom about her plans, one can’t consider that she’s trying to gain profit from SM’s work or take SM’s fans.
Would the above be *unethical*?
Since the story would be different and she’s not asking for anyone’s money, I assume one could say that it is not.
I guess everyone’s major problem around here should be that those authors that pull do it and 1. ask from their ff readers to buy their ff turned to story work 2. Don’t complete the story and attempt to make their ff readers to buy their book to see how the story ended 3. Don’t complete the story the way they would’ve completed it if they hadn’t had a publishing deal and tell their ff readers to buy the book to see the better ending.
Now, *that* is unethical. *That* is gaining from SM fanbase and SM work, because if it weren’t for SM and her characters the authors wouldn’t have fans to buy their unknown book when it first comes out.
Okay, so here’s another question to think about. What about those fanfic authors that write an original piece of literature, then uses their fanbase to market their “original” book? Even though the story is original, with this logic, aren’t they doing the same thing that an author that pulls to publish is doing? They would be using SM’s Twilight fanbase as a jumping board for their original work. Is this not as frowned upon because it’s original and not fanfiction? Or is it only the combination of both the story and the marketing to the fandom that is annoying?
If an author of original fiction announces to their fans that they are publishing another novel, that is quite okay by me. They earned those fans, through their talent of writing an original story. While they would be reaching out to encourage fans to buy the new book, they can also assume that said fans would be interested because they are fans.
If an author of fan fiction announces to their fans they are pulling their fan fiction to publish it as “original” fiction–yes, it bothers me a lot, because their fans are fans of fan fiction, Twilight fan fiction. I would argue their fans are fans of S.M. first, and it would be in their best interest, because they enjoy participating in the Twilight fandom, to not support the move of this fan fiction author.
Plus, what I’ve said in the post below, for me, the ethics are all about the financial aspect of it. I believe that turning a fan fiction story into “original” fiction is wrong. Period.
My point was that if you’re going to say that what SM wrote was a form of fanfic because she took an idea (vampire falls for human) that was not original and wrote a story with that idea that was directly inspired by classics like P&P and WH, *then* you need to say that most, if not all, literature (not even just modern, as has been pointed out) is a form of fanfic because almost every single author has been inspired by someone else’s story or an actual event or something else. There’s not much left that’s truly and completely original.
I’m all for a healthy debate. 🙂
For me, I think it is wrong to turn fan fiction into “original” fiction period. I don’t care if you go with TWCS, Omnific, or manage to Random House interested in your story–I still believe it is wrong.
I believe a story that was originally written as fan fiction can never be considered truly original, because there are so many different themes, relationships, settings, etc. that authors use that are borrowed from Twilight. Even if your “John/Edward” is covered in tattoos and swears like a sailor, he still has two friends–one a large bear of a man, the other a smooth talking Southern gentleman who each happen to have their perfect mate, a blonde bombshell and a tiny, pixie-like shopahaulic, he still has this undeniable attraction to a rather plane looking girl who has a sometimes crazy mother and a father who lives in a small town–possibly in Washington state, …
For me, the all of the ethics are not in direct relation to the monetary aspect of attempting to see a refurbished fan fiction story as “original” fiction; although, I won’t argue that this is a huge breach of ethics as well.
I guess, I don’t believe an author can take a story that was originally written as fan fiction and turn it into truly original fiction, because if you truly change everything–the characterizations, the relationships, the locations–how would the story even work? Would it even make sense?
If you are talented enough to have a story published by a legitimate publisher, why wouldn’t you want it to truly be a work of original fiction?
I don’t read much AH but my impression is that there are some stories that are original (i.e., far enough away from the characterizations and situations in Twilight) enough to be considered original works.
Are they GOOD enough to be published as such? In my opinion, heck no, but that’s another matter.
HOWEVER, the writers did not present the work as original. They posted it as fan fiction. So to me, that material should not be lightly revised (the good old search-and-replace like we saw in the hilarious EdwardWesley twank) and offered for commercial publication.
You know what I find funny? No one holds a copyright on Jane Austen’s works. It is one of the few fandoms where you absolutely can get your fan fiction published, and in my five years of participating in JA fandom, I’ve only read two fics that were pulled to publish. TWO.
Yep I know I’ve said some of this before, but it bares repeating in relation to copyright and the law.
Copyright pertains to the expression of an idea, not the idea itself. This means you can’t copyright a simplified plot idea (girl meats boy who happens to be an actor, dentist, astronaut etc) or even a characterization (possessive traits, unruly hair etc). In the case of the former, a boy meets girl plot is considered part of the public domain. In the case of characterizations that may appear copied, these could come under the fair use provision in copyright. There are some people who actually argue that there is only a handful of plots in existance and all stories fall under them.
Fanfiction is by definition a derivative work and therefore not copyrightable until the work it is based on becomes part of the public domain. In the case of Stephanie Meyer you would need to wait for 70 years post her death to do this. Under the fair use provision law in the United States you may however be able to copyright a parody, or criticism of the character. This is how some movies & books that parody Twilight have come out.
In the case of fanfictions that are now being turned into books I think the jury is still out. If people are just changing the names and locations, then large parts of the work will be quite derivative of the twilight and in a court of law they may not be able to claim the fair use provision. This would especially be true if it can be proved to have previously been a fanfiction. It’s likely however copyright lawyers are only going to go after people if they really are making quite a lot of money out of it. If these books are only selling to current (and not disgruntled) readers of fanfic then they are not making lots of money.
Twilight copyright lawyers may not be the only people who could come after published works of (ex) fanficiton. A lot of writers use liberally other copyright owners work. This includes lyrics, poems etc. Most publishing house put in their contracts that an author asserts that their work is original and where copyright material is used, that they have sort permission to do so. This gives the publishing house a get out of free jail card when someone might seek to sue them.
I just want to add that FF works are publishable if the content is majorly different than the source of where they wrote a FF. I say this bc you all (Twank site owners) have been making a point to call the people who choose to publish their FFs that have reworked the content as ppl who are stealing from SM and it isn’t entirely true. It isn’t unethical. At least not IMO. It’s unethical to piggy back off of twilight related events to seek a profit BUT is it wrong for authors to solicit that info to the readers of their work on FF or personal blogs/twitter? NO. It isn’t. Especially when it comes to All Human stories. There are stories that don’t resemble anything in twilight other than that character names and the way they look physically….and that’s all. If I wrote a FF that was autobiographical but changed the physical appearance of the characters to fit those of Twilight and gave them those canon names…who does that story/intellectual property belong to? ME.
From the US Copyright Office in reference to derivative works:
“A typical example of a derivative work received for registration in the Copyright Office is one that is primarily a new work but incorporates some previously published material. This previously published material makes the work a derivative work under the copyright law. To be copyrightable, a derivative work must be different enough from the original to be regarded as a “new work” or must contain a substantial amount of new material. Making minor changes or additions of little substance to a preexisting work will not qualify the work as a new version for copyright purposes. The new material must be original and copyrightable in itself. Titles, short phrases, and format, for example, are not copyrightable.”
so in short it appears that if the content is different enough from the source material then it’s copyrightable and then of course fair game to be published…it’s just all a matter of what publishing house will want to pick up such a project if the author is honest about it.
Yo copyright. Imma let you finish but first I’m gonna go sell my fanfiction.
LOL’ing! I still haven’t tired of this Kanye joke, and now I’m jealous that you beat me to it.
I should have tired of this joke long ago, but it hasn’t happened. Yep. Still funny. 🙂
I think this should be the Twankhard tagline for a day.
Finding Bella is the last story that should be published it sucks so bad.
Tanya girl, I usually hate your skank ass calling him Eddie and shit and purring and being all pouty and strawberry blonde in fics but you are RIGHT ON.
That fic is shit.
lol. just, lol.
I’ll see your fic database and raise you a copyright infringement.
convenient excuse to pull your story that was going nowhere (and unfortunately…it was going nowhere very very slowly).
There are simply no words but “ended.” ROFLMAO
beautiful performance by the author of the story that I don’t remember! I need popcorn.
OT: Can I post gifs? I feel like I saw them before but the html doesn’t seem to be working?
You can paste the link to the image and we can do the rest. We don’t know which setting to change to make it so that anonnies can do it.
Hahaha, OMG, there is so much pathetic in this fandom I’m surprised it hasn’t collapsed under the sheer weight of it. I love, LOVE, how all these idiots talk about what is within THEIR rights as the fan fiction author. Hey, how about you go look up the six exclusive rights given to copyright holders (say, STEPHANIE MEYER) and then we’ll talk about your rights.
I made the mistake of looking at the reviews for this stupidity. This one killed me:
“You can and should potect ALL of your plot lines and titles with registration as SM did so many years ago when Twilight was just a college girls story. She was then able to refute the claims brought against her soundly.
You must all stop thinking of yourselves and fight the problem at its source.
Ignoring it only exacerbates a problem, it will NOT go away but will rise up AGAIN AND AGAIN to further hurt someone else.
Be professional, find out what you can do about it and then utiize your fan base to call for reinforcing help. There are are millions of us who will undoubtably back you up.
Do your research.”
Yes, please, DO YOUR RESEARCH. It would be a favor to the rest of us with common sense. Your MILLIONS of readers will thank you for it when you have to put your POS story (Twilight fan fiction that has *nothing* to do with Twilight) back up.
‘Millions’ *snort*
I know that the Twi fanbase is pretty big, but come on, only a small percentage of that group know and/or care about ff. Hell, if you’d asked me a year ago, I couldn’t have told you what fanfic is, even though I was (embarrassingly) pretty deep into Twi at the time.
I know, right? Go to the reviews and look at that reviewer’s pen name. Hahaha, they’re obviously not playing with a full deck anyway. *whistles “one of these things is not like the others”*
“Be professional, find out what you can do about it and then utiize your fan base to call for reinforcing help. There are are millions of us who will undoubtably back you up.”
Professional! Professional by stealing someone else’s characters, by trying to re-publish smthg already published on the internet! I’m sure what this person meant was use use your fanbase to get people to buy your books. “Undoubtably.”
“Fanbase” makes me laugh so hard.
In the comments she says it has nothing to do with Twilight!!
I know she can’t spell or construct a sentence or even convey meaning through words according to her post (never read her story), but surely she’s not that dumb.
1) the names are the same
2) there would be no HUGE FANBASE (heh) if not for the fans of Twilight.
Sounds like someone wanted some attenshun. She got it, I suppose.
This is not a comment on your comment (although I do agree with you there), but rather, it is on a comment on your anonymous “name.”
I LURVE it. 🙂
Are these FanFic authors acting/reacting like this as because a previous FF author but then in another fandom successfully published books?
I have never read that author’s fanfiction and only came across her books last week… But is that what it is?
When do they learn/think that when they write fanfiction you can’t copyright the story as you are already playing/writing with copyrighted characters?
I’ve been totally off FanFiction at the moment because of this bullshit of the authors who keep pulling their stories off from FF.
If you want to have a future in publishing, make your own unique story, write it, stay away from any FanFiction website and try your damn best to get it published by a proper publish place/house whatever it is called.
My rant is over for now, but how good a story is, as soon as I read Copyright or I see that stupid Copyright sign… I stay away from it…
Someone please decode this:
“the right from the author to take the story they’ve created to a larger readership”
I have no idea what that actually means.
She’s not a native speaker. She means the rights of the writer to take her precious Twilight rip-off away from the fandom and turn it into bestselling original fiction.
Tempted to make a red-pen gif for the Twanksters to use every time one of these come up.
With this, you’d end up red-penning so much that it would look like a True Blood vampire had exploded across the screen, it would be that messy and, well…red.
I just brought it up because you asked what she meant. I can think of a couple of languages that would use the proposition “from” instead of “of” in this case. But that’s not the reason she seems rude. She seems rude because she is. 🙂
It’s all good 😉
I just can’t take a story/blog seriously if it is full of typing mistakes.
It is an automatic turn off.
It’s my inner snob.
It totally distracts from the writing/story.
Which may or may not be a good thing! heh.
I just found this blog and had to swallow my glee. FINALLY. FF is not exactly rocket science, but some people are treating it like we are curing cancer.
When will writers learn that major publishers (you know, the types that actually pay writers and distribute their work with publicity) will not touch FF. By its very nature, FF is a copyright infringement.
The twi audience is a loyal, fanatical audience. Its not a reflection of RL readers. A fic with 7000+reviews gets most of them from the same core group of people. They are drawn to E/B in various situations, not various situations with original characters. If they wanted that, they would- wait for it- pick up a book (you know those things that are actually published and distributed for profit).
Let’s not even start with posting it in a public forum and then getting irritated when people copy it. I mean- hello? Its on a free website!!!! Personally, I am amazed people have the time to copy them.
I went to the DB site on principal. Let’s be honest, most of the smut factor is not being touched by a mainstream publisher. And that’s what the pervs love to read. So that eliminates pretty much 70% of each story.
Sigh. Thank goodness for twank. Keep it real!
Downloading stories is really quick though. I know of at least two websites that take seconds, and two downloaded programs that do it.
I agree with you guys. It’s fan fiction. As long as your name is on it, who cares if people pass it around? Of course some people think their fanfic is “like totally copyrighted!” and they have the right to send out C&Ds. One of my favorites so far (second only to The Office wank) has been the person who claimed she transformed her copyrighted original fiction into Twific and that said copyright transferred to the fan fiction and everyone passing the story around was in violation of her original copyright.
Please she did the same thing that the writer of In the Land of Milk and Honey did, she had no fucking clue how she was going to end the story, or where she was taking it next so she pulled the old blame the fandom, need to do what right for me and pulled.
As a fic writer I could careless if someone passes my story on to someone else, as long as no one is trying to claim it as their own work. Not that that anyone would want to claim my crappy work, but that is besides the point. I write for fun, I know it’s out there and if I pull it well it’s the net it will still be out there. Just like books that have been published, that are no longer in print, people have copies of them, so you’re still going to have people reading them and passing them along to their friends.
I read Finding Bella up until maybe six? chapters ago, it could have been a good fic, only she went from saving Bella, to making her Edward’s sex toy. I flounced it just to off track for me.
In the Land of Milk and Honey was ridiculous the way she flounced. Maybe she is publishing it. I think she had a clear vision of ending it but she got scared “under pressure.”
People need to realize that some of these authors get all scared when they’re fic gets noticed. Like the can’t handle the pressure. There’s NO fucking pressure. It’s fan fiction.
I can’t count how many times and story will have continuous updates then it’ll be red’d by some bigwig and they author gets all squirrely and starts taking a shit load of ‘vacations’ and breaks like they’re a celebrity and now that papps are on their ass.
Watch.
“The Perfect Wife, whose author is about to have some kind of big reveal in the next eight days”
That big reveal is the publication of her original fiction, not TPW. The publishing house has released no information regarding TPW. You might want to go back to your rumor-mill on that one.
say what? someone is actually publishing that? & more to the point someone in RL is actually going to claim to have written that filled with incest & rape & all kinds of stuff fic!?! the mind CAN NOT comprehend some people.
It never ends does it. ObsessingOverEdward hasn’t pulled her fic yet, it’s complete, but she’s publishing Holding Out for You. My guess? TWCS. **eyeroll**
She’s in the process of pulling it, slowly but steadily. The first ten chapters of HOFY as well as Devil’s Angel are missing already.
All of obsessive over Edwards stories will be on the gdocs site by this weekend
lol! Oh she won’t like this, especially since she had such a hissy fit over someone else writing a ‘Single Mom Bella Dating Doctor Edward’ story. She demanded she pull her story since HER’S was copyrighted and was in the process of being published. She made a huge stink about it and got some of crazy Knighters on it, put a note out on her blog (which has disappeared, I wanted to twank it myself but it’s gone now) but once people started telling her to SIMMER DOWN NAO, she shut up and deleted anything making her look like a twankasaurus.
I think you have your facts wrong. She sent a letter to someone that took a great deal of her story ideas (I think it was over 20 unrelated Twilight references, and some were very specifically HOFY) and that person attacked her on twitter. She never said a word, but posted the letter she sent when lies about the letter were being circulated via twitter. I watched the whole thing and it wasn’t pretty.
I don’t think so, but thanks for telling me that. If she thought she was right, and wasn’t acting ridiculous, why would she delete the blog stating all the similarities? Oh…right. Because it was RIDICULOUS.
1. Bella is a single Mom. (no one wrote that before.)
2. Bella’s ex is Jake. (Totally non-twi related fo sho)
3. Bella’s friends are Rose and Alice. (Riveting)
4. Bella’s son likes baseball. (Little boy likes baseball? NO WAY!)
5. Bella meets Edward. Doctor Edward. (Totally copyright OOE.)
6. Bella sings her song a disney song. (HOW DARE SHE!)
7. I’d list more but OOE took it down.
8. OOE showed she was butthurt that people didn’t come to her rescue, and instead told her basic ideas are not owned by her.
9. Shush.
I’m not one to defend BNA’s because they’ve proven to be egomaniacs, but in this instance I have to disagree with you.
I had just finished reading HOFY when the drama started with ilsoucantante so I decided to go read her story, and I have to say that OOE had grounds to send the letter she did.
At first I thought OOE was overeacting because we’ve seen this kind of drama before, but after reading the fic I could see her concerns. There were several very specific scenes that screamed HOFY, even if they weren’t word-for-word, they were very close. I’m not sure that I would have caught everything if I hadn’t read the letter, but since HOFY was fresh in my mind it wasn’t hard to see the spots that were questionable.
You listed 8 incidents, but OOE list was in the high twenties. You also said that she whined and complained until people told her to shut up. I don’t recall a peep from her. If anything, once OOE posted the letter, the chatter stopped.
From the letter she said she was trying to keep things between the two of them and it wasn’t until ilsoucantante and her bitch posse slammed her for several hours that she finally tweeted a link to the letter, but after that she said nothing.
So, I think that your accusations about her whining and then running away to lick her wounds are unfounded. I think she handled the situation as best she could for being attacked for addressing her concerns. It takes a bigger person to keep their mouths shut when they are being ripped apart by the loud-mouths on twitter than it does to whine to the minions and have your clit licked by your friends. I lost all respect for ilsoucantante when the dust finally settled.
Thank you!
Everyone is free to decide on their own whether or not OOE was plagiarized, but let’s get the facts straight here. Here is exactly what happened:
OOE was concerned because of more than 20 similarities between her story and Answering Bell by ilsucantante/wearingwords. These similarities were pointed out to her by some of her readers over a matter of several months. Once she read the whole story and saw all of the similarities for herself, she decided to send an email to ilsuocantante/wearingwords outlining her concerns. OOE wanted to keep everything on the down-low and hoped they could work things out between the two of them.
It was ilsuocantante/wearingwords who decided to take to Twitter and start moaning about the situation, as if she was somehow being victimized. In fact, she whined on Twitter before she even responded to OOE’s email.
OOE never even got into it, on Twitter or on any forum. It was a few of her friends, including ikss, who went after ilsuocantante/wearingwords on Twitter. After all of the drama, OOE finally decided to post the email she had originally sent to ilsuocantante/wearingwords on her website so that people could make their own decision on the matter. She hasn’t talked about the issue in public, except to post that email.
Are you fucking kidding me with this?
-Bella is divorced from Jake (who she had romantic feelings for in canon) because he cheated with an accessible female character in canon (Leah)? So original! How did OOE come up with this? Also, what is… divorce? I don’t understand this concept.
-Bella moves away from a tiny town after an unpleasant divorce? *gasp* So, in AB did she move to California like in HOfY? Oh wait, no she didn’t, even though ilsuocantante lives there & could have justified it.
-Bella has a son?! *GASP* Thief! Who likes baseball?! THEIF THEIF (really? REALLY?!)
-Edward (whose whole family made a big deal about playing baseball in canon) is a little league coach? Strehhhhtch. That is *so* not canon! (where’s my sarcasm font?)
-Jake contacts Bella & upsets her? An asshole ex-husband didn’t leave her feeling warm and fuzzy? Geez. I wish I knew what this *original* concept called “divorce” was so I had a better understanding of how exes might interact.
-Bella befriends the Cullen clan?! Seriously. ::blank stare::
-Edward kisses her boo-boo to make it better? Who does that? OOE must have invented that one. weird.
-And no one has ever heard “If you wanted to see me again, all you had to do was ask/call.” in a mocking tone in a movie or book before. Noooo. COPYRIGHT THAT SENTENCE!
-The ex wants his wife back? Shockingly original. Once again if I knew this “divorce” thing…
-A cougar mom hits on the coach? Nooo.
-The coach nicknames his players? WHO DOES THAT?!
-I’m just gonna blank stare over that intimate dessert thing. Apparently sharing sweet foods has been copyrighted by OOE. Everyone comply accordingly.
-The fandom at large doesn’t use the term “mama bear”.
-Bella, a single mom, worries she might not be enough for her son? So she’s a caring parent? I wasn’t aware OOE had invented the concept of a concerned single mother, especially considering ilsuocantante *is* a single mother.
-Does this mean I’m violating copyright if I sing Just Keep Swimming?
-Let’s not mention that Edward’s “loved one” is of a totally different nature. Wife vs father is very different. But WAIT! People… DIE?! NOOOOOOOOOOO!
I’d also like to mention that OOE commented elsewhere that Edward being a doctor was a non-canon detail and therefore her creation, even though he had attended med school TWICE in Twilight and expressed that he didn’t practice because he didn’t have Carlisle’s control.
This is plain ridiculous. If you have ever encountered ilsuocantante, it is clear that she doesn’t care enough to steal someone else’s ideas. She herself stated that clearly they both had less than original ideas for their stories.
People try way to hard to assure themselves the are unique, beautiful snowflakes and sorry but people and therefore themes in literature/fiction are typically very similar.
“This is plain ridiculous. If you have ever encountered ilsuocantante, it is clear that she doesn’t care enough to steal someone else’s ideas. She herself stated that clearly they both had less than original ideas for their stories.”
She doesn’t? ::blinks::
Check out this website http://fic-club.blogspot.com/
Then check out Isocantante’s website she started many months later. http://twificclub.blogspot.com/
A fic club website isn’t all that original, but, not only did she start a website that was similar in function, she used a very similar name and stole the same graphics. OOE isn’t the only person to have grievences with this woman for her “borrowing”.
Not only was there the Fic-Club thing (which…I can buy two people having the fic-club idea, but the GRAPHIC????), but she wrote a one shot that was extremely similar in some striking ways to a O/S written by someone else.
As some have mentioned here, the ways in which Answering Bell is similar to HOFY (even though there are over TWENTY similarities, which seems excessive) could be written off as coincidence. Any of these incidents, take on their own, could be written off as just two people having similar ideas. But when you lump them all together…well, something smells rotten.
Wait! I missed this! HOFY is NOTHING like Answering Bell.
Edward isn’t a doctor in AB. Esme is an agoraphobic. Edward has TWO kids in HOFY and Liz is a bitch child. Answering Bell’s Edward is single and always was, no dead wife Tanya.
OOE actually bitched about the two being similar? Please! Johnnyboy’s La Dolce Vita is closer to HOFY than Answering Bell. I can’t believe that shit.
Before posting lists and calling OOE ridiculous, why don’t you read both stories and get your facts straight?
Okay..okay, I’ve read both. I had read HOFY ages ago but when all this shit came out, I decided to read AB. Are they similar stories? Yes. Did ilsuo rip stuff of from OOE? IMO, no. The stories are similar and that is it. A subject matter such as a single mom meets handsome doctor is going to have similarities. If we are going to nit-pick over song choices or lines you think were lifted(and OOE thinks are owned by her,) then whoever said ‘battling for dominance’ or created a bruised past Edward first should be millionaires.
I get that shit got out of control because ilsuo posted the email but mud was being thrown on both sides. At least from what I could see. A PP said she lost all respect for ilsuo? I only lost respect for one person and that was ikiss who compared what was going on between OOE and ilsuo to stealing and raping something someone else wrote. IDK, I dont like people using the word ‘rape’ to describe a difference of opinion over something in FF. It was kinda twisted.
I kinda don’t know why OOE took down her blog post about it (thanks for someone posting it) but oh well.
Oh and have you read ilsuocontante’s stuff? She’s very good. Her new fic is AU and is very nicely written. It seems to me she doesn’t need to ‘steal’ from anyone.
I read both stories, and while they do share the things listed by OOE, I don’t think plagiarism is at play here. The commonalities are too general and universal to most stories and aspects of stories involving single mothers, divorce, little league baseball coaches, and Twilight fanfic in general to be claimed as the “intellectual property” of anyone let alone a fanfic writer. There were also much bigger differences between the two stories that made them different enough that I never felt like I was reading identical stories at all.
There were too many differences to even say they have something in common.
Holding Out For You and Molto Bella are already up. I bet Devil’s Angel will be coming any day now on the gdocs site.
I see it’s up. It’s missing some of the outtakes, though. Should I send them to you?
Yes! Twilightffnstories@gmail.com
She’s publishing Holding Out For You? o_O! I thought she was one of the good once. i.e. the non-greedy pulled FF bitches. I guess I was wrong.
It’s kind of disappointing, isn’t it? The number of fic writers that seemed to have missed the entire point of fanfiction and fandom. Sometimes I wonder if Twilight fandom is intentionally getting punk’d by opportunistic, vanity press enthusiasts.
I think you all should let OOE speak for herself before jumping to conclusions. As a friend of hers, I would like to clear up a couple of things, though. I don’t particularly care to see you all just hypothesize about what she’s doing and why and then judge her based on what are, in truth, misconceptions.
1) She is NOT publishing anything with either Omnific or TWCS, least of all HOFY.
2) While yes, she is in the process of pulling stories from ffn, re-vamped versions of the stories are going to be made available on her website. This includes HOFY. Read her comments on her ffn profile page: http://www.fanfiction.net/u/1456416/
3) Even though she is pulling her stories, she did so in the nicest way possible, starting with the first few chapters and going slowly so that people who were in the process of reading the story could finish. I think to lump her in with people like this ekkimuh person is really unfair.
She’s sticking to ‘cannon’ now? Sorry, that’s one of my FF pet peeves. It’s canon–not cannon. 😉
Dear Ekimmuah,
I hope to God you read this. STOP trying to justify the practice of getting fan fiction stories published! You may have written a story yourself (and I leave out the word “original” here on purpose; BDSM stories have been done to death) but the fact that you claim it has nothing to do with Twilight is laughable! The ONLY reason people are reading your story is because of Twilight! That and your story contains smut. You have taken characters made popular by someone else, used them to gain a fan base, and now you are trying to cash in on it! Has nothing to do with Twilight my ass! It is because of people like YOU that the entire practice of writing fan fiction for FUN will be banned! Get off your high horse and just admit to yourself that the ONLY reason you have readers is because of Twilight! Don’t believe me? Write something completely NEW and ORIGINAL, don’t change Edward and Bella’s names in one of the stories you’ve already written, and publish it somewhere under “original stories” and see how many followers you get.
The Ended.
“The Ended.”
*snarf*
The list is purely for convenience sake. Not for profit. Not a way of thumbing our nose at the authors. We love the authors and their stories, that’s why they are a part of the list. We also give full credit to the authors.
We don’t change the text of the story, just remove excess html and author notes. Another issue we try to take care of is formatting. We clean them up, prettify (YES, thats a word… well maybe not) them, and allow people to pick and choose what they’d like to read. We actually go to great lengths searching out Author names, summaries and banners for the stories because sadly, not all come to us complete with that information. It’s not always fruitful, but we try.
And, tbh, we have received a very positive response from the readers.
Put her one shot from the All Hallows Eve in there too. It’s number 16, one shot 14. 33, from Ohio = Ekimmuh for the win!
Is there anyway to make them a more normal font? some are in like papyrus or something.
Yep. We can make the font more normal.
I’ve been known to read a lot of crap. I’m not very discerning when it comes to fan fic, so it goes without saying that when I don’t even have that on a TBR list, it’s gotta be utter crap.
Good luck getting it published. Oh wait, TWCS and Omnific REALLY don’t count.
How does
“I am publishing a novel (not Finding Bella)”
work with this
“With that said, I want to assure you that you all will get your ended. Unfortunately, due to what is going on, you are now going to wait until the story is published. It will be a series of books instead of one…”
Excuse me dear fandom writer, I thought I read above that you were not going to publish this story! Did you change your mind after that paragraph or just accidentally announce your real intention. Obviously this fanfucktion writer saw this as a very good opportunity to pull her story. Whine more about your rights. Maybe you’d like to speak to Stephenie Meyer, huh?
Can I just make a note that not all of the stories posted on TWCS are fanfictions that have been converted? There are several wholly original stories about to be released in the near future. Do those authors deserve to be ridiculed and discounted automatically? I think not. Also, The Perfect Wife is NOT the story being published. If you bothered to go to the website and read the summary, it is plain to see that this is an entirely different and separate story coming out in just under a week.
It’s still a fake publisher with low standards.
“rmcrms5”, is that you? *lol*
It’s a *publisher* ran by a 20 year old. At least psymom and Omnific seem to know what their doing. Though psymommy needs her own psychological evaluation trying to sell fanfics though.
Technically, it is a real publisher. Well, it will be once it actually publishes something.
The true question, in my opinion, is one of legitimacy. Can a publisher of e-books, one that has some (maybe not all, but some) books which are fan fiction stories turned into “original” novels, ever be considered legitimate?
I don’t think so.
I think that those authors, the ones who are truly writing original fiction that has not been transformed from a story previously posted as fan fiction, are doing themselves a great disservice by settling for a publisher like TWCS or Omnific.
I think someone made this point on this thread or another, but the thing is–not everyone is good enough to be published. The business of being an author and making a living from it is a very difficult one to get into, and honestly, I wouldn’t have it any other way. If everyone could do it, it wouldn’t be as honored of a profession as it is–honored in the sense that you have to have talent to be able to be published by a legit publishing house.
As I’ve stated previously, this is such a hot button topic for me. I could go on for days. But, I honestly believe that places like Omnific and TWCS are not only harming the Twilight fandom–at least the fan fiction portion of it–but they are doing the authors they work with a disservice. Would those authors ever be taken seriously in the real world of legitimate publishing?
I think the answer is no.
Can I hug you?
yes to everything you said.
I’m a real publisher too then. I’ve got a printer with ink, some paper and a binding machine. Ca-ching! Who wants to pull their story next for Annonie Press©?
Someone sent me a link to “How to publish ebooks in Word 2010.” The site explained how to save word files as pdf’s. That’s how you make an ebook these days. That’s ALL it takes! *snort*
A traditional publisher prints from PDF these days (film is no longer used). The making of a document into PDF is not really the issue. Rather it is the content that makes all the difference.
Agreed.
What your saying is you are looking down on them, like some paperback published authors look down on e-book, like medium press writers look down on small press and so on and so on. All saying they aren’t up to their level. I’ve seen so many writers from SM to Stephen King to Shakespere trashed. Some writers say anyone not with the big six will never be taken seriously. It gets old. Why can’t authors support each other for a change. It’s no wonder new writers find it so hard to get a look in.
If the writers are good their writing will speak for itself. No agent is going to turn down an amazing original story by a talented writer they are sure will sell because they’ve been with either TWCS or OF. They would be crazy to.
If all these writers are crap, both publishers will close soon enough and everyone can sit back, laugh and say I told you so.
I wouldn’t say that I am looking down of the authors, assuming that is who you are referencing, because they are choosing to publish their “original” fiction as an e-book. The e-book factor, for me, doesn’t matter at all.
I am “looking down on them,” because they are choosing to sell their refurbished fan fiction stories as “original” fiction. I think it is wrong and unethical.
Also, I don’t think these authors, the ones who publish fan fiction as “original” fiction, are doing a very good job of supporting other authors. What about Stephenie Meyer? Shouldn’t she get a consideration in all this? I would argue that what they are doing is the exactly opposite of supporting another author, it is taking advantage and stealing from another author.
I’m also not saying the writers are crap. I think some of the writers who have chosen to publish fan fiction as “original” fiction are actually talented. I think some of them are actually talented enough to write a truly original novel and have it published by a legit publishing house. However, they have not chosen to do this. I won’t sit here and applaud their actions simply because they managed to get published, because I think that what they have done is wrong.
ONLY the greedy publish with Omnific and TWCS. If Stephenie Meyer can get her shit published these people cane publish their stories.
That bitch who published News to Me started this shit. She pulled and it got published and everyone is jumping “Oooh Oooh I wanna be a published author toooo!”
Only the TRULY GREEDY pull a fan fic, completed or not and try to publish it. Go gamble if you’re that greedy.
Write an ORIGINAL fic not using Edward and Bella and publish THAT. Greedy ass.
I flounced this fic after her Edward insisted on turning a girl who was the vicitm of gang-rape, beatings and other non-concensual BDSM activity into his own personal submissive. It was his way or the high-way. She caught hell on the Twilighted thread and couldn’t defend her characters actions other than to say he’s helping her in his own way. Um, no. She then brought in her own personal bullying team to insult and run off posters opposed to her view.
Pretty sure her bullying team was actually eki herself. All her fans seem to have gone *poof*. So much for that whole “popular fic” delusion she has going on. If it weren’t for her multiple personalities she would’ve had no defenders at all.
Christ alive, THAT’S what that story is about?! So glad I hadn’t heard of it until this post. I’m sure TWCS will have no problem “publishing” such disgusting, insipid drivel. It seems to be their forte. But I wish she would try to shop it to people with standards, I’d love to be a fly on the wall for that.
Wow…bitter much? I heard about this site and just had to come check out what all of the fuss was about. I mean, how could 3 lurkers (if that’s who is really running this site) turn the bulk of the fandom into a pack of raving lunatics…oh that’s right…the vast majority of the fandom were a bunch of bitchy, wanna-be-popular, no-life crazies to begin with.
Did it ever occur to any of you that you are just as pathetic as those you ridicule? You sit and read your fanfiction, bitching about the lack of updates and what the author has or has not done with the characters and/or plot, throwing hissy fits when an author decides to pull their work *which by the way IS their work to move or pull or not*. You spend your time on threads and in chat rooms and on twitter discussing this shit like it actually matters. Do you have lives? Seriously? Do you work? Do you take care of your families? Of course, the same could be said of many FF writers. Inflated Egos R Us?
And for those of you who are putting Stephanie Meyer on a silver platter, perhaps you should read some other vampire novels before making her sound like SHE AND SHE ALONE came up with the idea of a human being with a vampire, vampires allowed to go out during the day, shape shifters, hot vampire guys, mind-readers, human girls being changed to vampires by their boyfriends, etc.. Both the Sookie Stackhouse series and Vampire Diaries were published well before Meyer had her “meadow dream.” Did either of those authors come after Meyer for copyright infringement? Many in these two fandoms felt “their” authors should have gone after her, sighting that SHE is a thief of their original ideas. There are actually hate pages dedicated to S. Meyer. So it is rather laughable that the bulk of people posting on here think S. Meyer actually has a right to go after anyone who publishes a story that, oh my god, has anything remotely similar to one of her “original” ideas. Plagiarism is defined in dictionaries as “the wrongful appropriation, close imitation, or purloining and publication, of another author’s language, thoughts, ideas, or expressions, and the representation of them as one’s own original work.” Based on this, S. Meyer could indeed be held liable for plagiarism herself. As a matter of fact, in April of 2009 S. Meyer was indeed sued for copyright infringement. Did it go anywhere? No. Why? Because her shit is the same shit writers have done over and over and over again….dating back to Bram Stoker’s “Dracula.”
Do I think every FF out there should be published? Hell no. Do I think there are many out there that are original in idea and characterization, simply using S. Meyer’s character names…Yes.
The thing I find the most amusing about this site is that those running it, and those leaving hateful comments, don’t even have the balls to say who they are. You all are hiding. You are chicken-shits. You want to flame authors, FF sites, etc… do it but at least have the fucking courage to face those you flame. Courage and possibly something factual as well, because most the vomit coming out of your mouths is nothing more than that…vomit. Idk if this will be posted. If it is, I’m sure you’ll send your henchmen (do chicken-shits have henchmen?) after me. ROFL. Peace, love, and f*off.
Ok, you have some points I agree with, and some I don’t, but please do us one courtesy.
If you are going to insult us, at least have the decency to pull on your big girl panties and TYPE OUT your profanities.
And if you’re a dude who isn’t into wearing female undergarments, then I have to ask, what the *bleep* are you doing lurking around this site?
You do realize that EVERYONE on this site is anonymous, including you, right?
Girl, I see how you’re trying really hard to sweet-talk and defend your plans to publish fanfiction but it does remain illegal. You made the big mistake to openly acknowledge the connection by posting it as Twilight fanfiction. Now don’t try to worm your way out of it by telling the world how awful Stephenie (that’s how the name is spelled) Meyer is. It’s her copyright. Hers. Not yours. Get over yourself.
wow, that’s a lot of commentary from someone who “has a life.”
tl;dr
FOR THE WIN YO!
There are some points you make that I agree with.
However, I think the main point of your argument–that S.M. used the same ideas as other vampire novels have used and therefore authors who are turning fan fiction into “original” fiction can’t be in trouble either, assuming I am understanding you correctly–is quite silly, in my opinion, because you are talking about two very different things.
Yes, Twilight might have themes in the story that are similar to themes that exist in other vampire novels. However, Twilight was never written as Sookie Stackhouse fan fiction story, featuring a brown-haired Sookie and a younger Bill (or Eric, if that’s your thing). Twilight fan fiction authors who pull their fan fiction stories to turn them into “original” fiction are trying to alter a story that has been written using Twilight characters, themes, settings, identities, relationships, and more. You can not just make minor adjustments and call it “original.” Something that was originally written as fan fiction can never been original.
I also want to make a few points in regard to your accusations about people who frequent this blog.
1. I have never, nor would I ever, flame an author–anonymously or not.
2. Anything I say on this blog–which is mainly all in relation to my opinion in regard to authors turning fan fiction into “original” fiction–I would be happy to share publicly, with my pen name attached. My pen name is not attached to comments I make here because of how the site has been created, otherwise I would be more than happy for you to know what my pen name is.
The anonymous comment thing is a benefit, because like it or not, there are “big” people in this fandom who run the show. People who, in my nearly three years of participation in this fandom, have taken advantage of that status and have treated others horribly and have acted horribly themselves. It is about time they are being called out on it.
3. I find it quite humorous that people who frequent this blog are often accused of “not having lives” or of “discussing this shit like it actually matters?” I want to ask you–is this the first Twilight blog you’ve visited?
What happens here, the discussion of things that happen in the Twilight fandom, happens on every Twilight blog I’ve ever been to: ADF, Twilighted forums, Edwardville, etc.
Why is it okay that people who visit those sites are allowed to discuss whatever they want, but when it happens here, the people doing the discussion are classified as losers, “pathetic,” and as not having lives?
I mean, let’s get real. None of us here to fix the economic crisis or end world hunger. We’re all here discussing things that happen in the Twilight fandom. You know why we do it?
It’s entertaining.
Does there need to be another reason?
I really want to do the whole tl;dr to myself, because I’m always long-winded when I post here!
wow… you make a lot of assumptions, get a life. Too bad we’ve already covered that mocking something on the internet does not consume our jobs, friends, and families. And lmao… chicken-shits? henchmen? Do you think anyone here cares enough to track your ass down? Nope, that’s for your lameasses to obsess about as you fuckers keep throwing out conjectures and alluding to “knowing” who is behind this site. Grow the fuck up, really. You are taking this too seriously for someone who posted with name “get a life.”
PS…tread lightly….your site could very well be sued for Libel and Slander, especially since you are opening publishing your remarks… According to the courts: Certain defamatory messages are slanderous or libelous PER SE, meaning that the plaintiff need not prove that the message damaged his or her reputation. Libel or slander per se occurs when the message accuses the plaintiff of committing a crime, of having a loathsome disease, or of being professionally incompetent. j/s
ekimmuh / purplemadpendragon is that you? “opening publishing your remarks”?
http://www.expertlaw.com/library/personal_injury/defamation.html
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Defamation
Good luck with that.
It probably was her. At least Moargan threatens with moargasms.That’s more entertaining than groundless threats to take legal action.
Okay. I hear you.
1. SM is definetely sitting in a plastic sparkly plater in my head, not a silver one.
2. I can think of 1 or 2 AH ff stories whose basic ideas are more interesting than Twilight’s. (NOT EP or MotU or tUofEM.)
3. The twilight saga could’ve easily been bad vampire fan fiction imo.
4. The legal points you made and the notes about SM weren’t out of place.
5. Twankhard are funny, even if they mock authors that pull their stories. I, personally, roll my eyes at those authors who have pulled, only because the stories that have been pulled aren’t good enough for publication even with a million changes.
6. As it is the right of everyone to post and pull stories, it is the right of everyone to comment on their actions. The authors that post and pull expose themselves. Exposure brings criticism. If they don’t like criticism, they shouldn’t post.
bahahahahahahahahahaha.
lolforever.
i can’t even….
This site is like Perez Hilton. Where’s his lawsuit?
You know when people start white knighting spew lawsuit crap that it’s a TWCS or Omnific person or published author or one of their ass kisser.
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA FOREVER.
BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!
Good luck with that one!
I have a rather lengthy comment to make about the new publishing houses. Nobody starts big. Every major publishing company in the world had humble beginnings from which they grew and progressed. I’m sure when Little Brown first started, many people were reluctant to publish with an unknown entity, but they gave them a chance and with a little time and patience, they hit gold and became the giant that they are today. Nobody can say with all certainty that the same success might not come to such companies as TWCS or Omnific with a little blood, sweat, tears, and perseverance.
I’ve also read arguments that some authors are doing a disservice to themselves by being published through them because not all people should be published. To the latter of that, I totally agree, but I don’t believe that the publisheres are stomping into this without closely examining the rough work submitted to them, seeing the diamond underneath that could arise with a lot of shaping and polishing.
In addition, I must add that I have read a lot of books that I personally felt should never have made it into publication. About half of all romance novels seem like cookie cutter versions of one another with different names and slightly different situations, but there is a massive market for them. NO, they will never be considered Great American Classics, but does that mean that they are completely lacking in value? NO.
I also think that most of these authors, as any author entering the business, go in knowing that they aren’t going to be instant celebrities. The percentage of published authors to go NYTimes Best Seller is depressingly tiny. Most of them, I believe, go into it for the love of the craft and the thrill of being in print. For some, that simple fact is a dream come true.
We are not all Jane Austens, Stephen Kings, Danielle Steeles, JK Rowlings, etc.. but of the plethora of authors on the market, very few are. The point of reading books is for entertainment, and that is a very subjective idea. What entertains one person may annoy another, and vice versa. It is not up to anyone posting here to decide what is or is not worthy of publishing. If a published book bombs, then apparently it did not appeal to a wider audience, and it if succeeds then they found their niche, but it is not for any one person here or anywhere to dictate as if they were a deity which is or is not going to do well, because you really are not clairvoyant and do not know what the future holds.
Yes but as someone who got the OmniFic versions of Trust In Advertising and Stitches and Scars and The Unidentified Redhead, I can tell you there is not much different between the FF.net version and the “reworked” version.
Meaning, they don’t, in fact, have a careful editing and polishing process like you said:
“I don’t believe that the publisheres are stomping into this without closely examining the rough work submitted to them, seeing the diamond underneath that could arise with a lot of shaping and polishing.”
They take shit stories, change the names, slap a cover on it, and call it a day.
That would be the only reason I would buy a converted fanfic (and I haven’t) – to see if they sound more professionally written than the fic version.
Oh I didn’t buy them, someone gave me their copies. I would never buy that shit. Ever.
Pull up the “first chapter preview” on the Boycotts and Barflies website then go open the PDF over on the database and you’ll see that the “big” difference is that it was changed from 1st person to 3rd person. Other then that and the different names, it’s the exact same.
THAT is why it’s not okay to “publish” fan fic. It’s still fan fic.
I bought Boycott’s and Barflies and the only changes are names, places and physical descriptions. Jobs are all still the same and even the “Grace” character is still unsure of herself and doesn’t know why “Michael” is in love with her.”Meg” aka Alice is perky and loves to shop and “Bianca” aka Rosalie, is still a tough but beautiful gal. Granted, if I hadn’t already known it was a fanfic, I wouldn’t have known it by reading the book. However, being B/E is what got me to read the ff in the first place. As an “original” fiction, I don’t find the story all that interesting and still haven’t completed it.
I find myself agreeing with something posted earlier. I can see why you would be excited and thrilled to have you story out in public with your name on the cover. However, since it was posted first as fanfic, it doesn’t seem wholly “original” to me.
Exactly! I read fanfic because I’m imagining a B/E situation. It doesn’t matter what new names they are given, I’m still going to think of these characters as B/E and other canon Twilight characters. If they want to be respectable authors and publish they shouldn’t have posted these stories as fanfiction. I’ve come up with many story premises but decided not to write them as fanfiction because they felt more like mine… I wanted to develop those ideas into something original, which wouldn’t be the case if I allowed them to become a part of the Twilight fanfiction archive (and best believe if you’re writing fanfiction, even if you pull it, it’s already and will always remain fanfiction for that respective fandom). I don’t think any of us are saying that fanfiction writers shouldn’t desire real publication, but creating a story and testing it out on the back of another fandom is unethical, and it will not gain you any fans.
I sure wish there was a gdocs account for sharing those so people could do the comparisons, and the argument that they were “polished” prior to “publication” could never be used again. Too bad there isn’t.
“Nobody can say with all certainty that the same success might not come to such companies as TWCS or Omnific with a little blood, sweat, tears, and perseverance.”
And if it does, it will be because they started by CHEATING. Making money off of fanfiction is wrong in so many ways. That seems to be what most people are pissed off about, not whether or not someone deserves to get published.
Poking fun at the quality of writing is only half of it. The other half is exposing just how crooked these companies are. They should be ashamed of what they’re doing. I find it disgustingly opportunistic and they should know better.
The likelihood of companies like Omnific making into the big time is pretty small. If they really did stumble upon the ‘next big thing’ then it’s likely that author would flounce them when a big publishing house swoops.
Besides legal issues of copyright and the fact that it is very easy to prove that these ‘novels’ once were fanfictions. The bigger issue is that I am yet to read a fanfiction that if you just change the names is ready for publication. The nature of fanfic is that the journey is half the fun. Part of the appeal of fanficiton beyond bring characters we already love (or hate) to life is the direct access to the author, other readers and the feedback loop this creates. This interactivity is compelling and allows us to forgive a lot of problems that a more objective light would shine on such as plot issues, inconsistent language and an over emphasis on lemons.
Fanfiction should be fun and a privilege that those who actually own the copyright allow us to do. Use the experience and go off and right your own stories.
I actually agree with some of the points you make. Not all people that have been published should have been published. Undoubtedly true. All publishers start somewhere, likely very small, before becoming big. Yes, I wholeheartedly agree.
However, I think my point about “disservice” might have gotten muddled a bit. I believe it was my comment you were referring to, and I’d like the opportunity to clarify.
My point was not that the disservice was due to the fact that not all authors should be published. My point was in regard to legitimacy. Publishers like TWCS and Omnific will not, in my opinion, ever be taken seriously in the publishing world, because some (or most) of the things they publish are refurbished fan fiction stories. Therefore, an author who is truly writing original fiction, who is not editing their fan fiction story to be “original,” is doing themselves a disservice by choosing (or agreeing to work with) a publisher like TWCS or Omnific.
I’m not here making any sort of judgment on what is or is not worthy of publishing–except in relation to stories that are refurbished fan fiction stories. I believe, with absolute certainty, that it is wrong to edit a fan fiction story and publish it as “original” fiction, and I think more people should question the ethical (and possibly legal–but I’m not lawyer) issues that are at play when this happens.
For me, it isn’t about quality. Your refurbished fan fiction story could be the best story ever written, but it is still a refurbished fan fiction story, and it can never be truly original.
I’ll “publish” your popular fanfic (read: turn it into a pdf), sell it online, and take a cut of the money.
Does that sound okay to all of you people out there that can’t understand why people are upset about this?
I cannot even comprehend why anyone would defend this shit.
The author wrote herself into a corner with the plot then contradicted herself and belittled readers asking legitimate questions on the Twi thread. Pay money to read the end of this? Not gonna happen.
Totally agree. The premise was decent and I found it interesting to start with. Then it became more about what Edward needed and less about saving Bella. Loved it on the thread when she brought in her “dom” friend or whatever the hell he was to bully and insult any and everyone who who found Edward’s actions deplorable. She finally refused to discuss it anymore and never did provide adequate reasoning for her characters actions.
Personally, I don’t agree with pulling fanfic to publish, but can see where *some* stories could make the jump from fanfic to original fic with heavy-handed edits by both the author and a professional editor. (I do not count my stories among those.) However, to lump future stories by what currently exists is unfair to the authors.
From my two years in the Twilight fanfic, I’ll admit that fanfic and reviews are wonderful. I’ve been writing for years before I discovered Twilight, and have binders filled with stories- including an original version of Lost and Found which will most likely never see the light of day. I do miss the instant gratification aspect of posting fanfic weekly, as well as getting to interact with my readers. Yes, I have pulled several of my stories from FFn to post on other sites where they aren’t in violation of TOS. They are still available to my readers, or will be shortly. (By the way- anyone have a copy of Relief you want to upload to the database or send to me directly? I can’t find a copy anywhere in my files after a laptop crash. I would love to repost it for those who enjoyed it.)
As one of the authors being published next week, I want to say that it is disheartening as an author to have the publishing house printing my original fiction referred to as a joke and cheater. I have a handful of short stories, poems, and drabbles published in anthologies and magazines by what I guess this site would refer to as “real” publishers.
I’m not expecting my readers to buy my book. If they do, great! I hope they enjoy it. If not, oh well.
Months of work have gone into this story in writing as well as editing. Let the critics and reviewers speak for the books once they are available, not before.
Thank you.
^Twilight fanfic fandom
As one of your prior comments have said- you really do need a post edit button. 🙂
I think it’s wonderful you are writing original stories and I STRONGLY encourage you to keep writing, get an agent, and go through a reputable publisher. What omnific is doing is illegal. In my opinion they are a scam and they are taking advantage of people in this fandom to make a few bucks. There are other independent publishers out there you can go to that are not this shady. good luck!
I feel a little differently about it. I think it’s too late for the stories to be pulled and re-worked into something “original” once you’ve allowed it to become a part of the fanfiction internet archive (it’s nearly impossible to remove that digital footprint). I do think there are some WRITERS who can make the leap from fanfiction to legitimately published writer given time, but with them, they should try for completely original stories. Do it like the rest of us do it… without using fans of another story as unknowing test subjects and free editors, without posting copies online anywhere to protect your “intellectual property.”
I couldn’t care less if people want to receive payment along with recognition for their writing.
My only concern with regards to reworked fanfics, is if SM or her publishers decide to make it an issue. If it resulted in the end of Twilight fanfiction, i’d be hella pissed.
Which she could very well do. Twilight fanfic has continued only because of the underground nature of the whole thing. Bringing it above ground, then profiting is not only dumb, but stupid. SM could sue every one of the writers for any and all profits. She could very well shut the whole thing down. The argument about respecting writer choices is absurd. They aren’t respecting SM’s characters. Would any of them consent to ff being written about their mediocre stories? Doubtful. These women are opportunist. They’re like MaryKay consultants. They’re peddling substandard product, feeding their insecurities and failing miserably about being reasonably intelligent business women.
I have always maintained this “fandom” found life due in part to bored women with little nothing going on in their lives. Looking for validation and acceptance in the only medium where they could. I agree, the “books” out there are the same as the fics. They are poorly edited, I found numerous typos in Boycotts and Stitches and Scars.
In response to the poster discussing publishing houses, there is a lot of ignorance as to what exactly a publishing entity is. TWCS and Omnific aren’t legitimate nor will they EVER be legitimate publishing houses. TWCS has at least hinted at publishing original work, Omnific is far too lazy to do this. They approach authors of popular fics. I won’t name names but they do in fact use another popular fandom “lady” to do outreach. She then gets kickbacks. The whole thing is disturbing. It’s akin to fraud IMO, and I do have to wonder how long before the shoe drops.
The 2 books I bought from Omnific were both original and there is sequels to both coming, so you saying they do not publish original falls flat on it’s face right there.
I’m actually begining to wonder if this blog was set up with the intention of ruining both companies and all signed authors with them, regardless of if the work is original or not. I see a hidden agenda begining to show.
I’m happy to give them a chance to show they can make both publishers work. Some of the stuff I won’t read, but then I don’t read everything any publisher puts out.
I have an even better conspiracy theory for you. Maybe the blog is actually run by Omnific and TWCS themselves, in the Locklearian belief that any publicity is good publicity.
Dance, puppets. Dance.
“TWCS has at least hinted at publishing original work, Omnific is far too lazy to do this. They approach authors of popular fics. I won’t name names but they do in fact use another popular fandom “lady” to do outreach. She then gets kickbacks. The whole thing is disturbing. It’s akin to fraud IMO, and I do have to wonder how long before the shoe drops.”
Exactly. They don’t even change the freaking title. TWCS is a crock too but at least it’s not going to be Just Wait parts 1-6. It’s “Old Wounds* then whatever other title.
TWCS is the lesser of the two fandom fraud evils. But at least they have some original works. Even a contest for original works that’s going to be books. Omnific has what?
Yes, but TWCS is also full of abusefic and rapefic. I don’t understand why anyone who aspires to be published by an established house would want to be associated with a site that posts stories full of incest, rape and abuse. I can only think that connection will hurt them in the long run.